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flylot

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Age : 67
Location : Houston, Texas
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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sat Jan 01, 2011 9:36 pm

Right now I am destroying Mozart's Violin Sonata K304 with my fiddle. The second movement is much harder to play than the first (sigh). I tend to gravitate to Baroque and of course the Sonatas & Partitas by Bach are the ultimate achievement for any violinist, amateur or pro, but I'm not there yet.

For piano works, Bach is still my favorite, with The Goldgberg Variations played by Gould to top the list. When I am in a melancholy mood, Chopin's Claire de Lune seems to fit the bill, providing it is accompanied by a good smoke and a suitable cognac.

But then, Beethoven's 9th for sheer orchestral sonic blow out....... and then there is Boccherini's fabulous Quintettino- La musica notturna delle strade di Madrid.......and then.... and then.......

.........Did I mention I like classical music?
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MisterE
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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sat Jan 01, 2011 10:49 pm

I was just listening to this one earlier today. Spectacular.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkipsBpOkYI&feature=related

I play this movement on trumpet when I´m in shape.... I´d love to play it like him.
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flylot

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 12:03 am

Oh yes! Wonderful! That first movement of the Partita #2 is probably the first one I would attempt. Itzak certainly has a fine rendition of it with his modern style violin. I would love to hear a Baroque violin master such as Andrew Manze's recording of it, or better, live.

It suspect that these pieces are just as difficult on brass as it would be on a violin.....
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MisterE
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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 1:46 am

flylot wrote:
Oh yes! Wonderful! That first movement of the Partita #2 is probably the first one I would attempt. Itzak certainly has a fine rendition of it with his modern style violin. I would love to hear a Baroque violin master such as Andrew Manze's recording of it, or better, live.

It suspect that these pieces are just as difficult on brass as it would be on a violin.....

I think it´s pretty tough on whatever instrument you´re playing it!

Correct me if I´m wrong. Isn´t the only difference beween modern and baroque the bow and how you hold the bow? The violin is the same (he plays a strad) which was made around that time.
Just wondering.
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Harlock999

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 1:57 am

Toccata and Fugue in D minor, from one of my favorite albums.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wea7So9oFoU
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flylot

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 10:27 am

MisterE,

Actually the Baroque violin is quite different than the modern violin though from a casual observer, it can easily be overlooked. The neck of the violin is attached to the body at much less of an angle, straight in fact, and the fingerboard is somewhat shorter. Inside, the bass bar is smaller.

All Strads were "Baroque period instruments" originally and were over the years transformed into the modern style by other luthiers. An easy way to detect a replacement neck to transition an originally Baroque period instrument to a modern day style is to look for the graft joint at the scroll. My German made violin has such a graft.

Also, most modern violins strings today have a synthetic (Perlon, kind of a nylon) core and are wrapped in metal (silver, aluminum, and most recently titanium) except for the E string which is steel (sometimes Gold plated). This makes the string more stable and less likely to go out of tune. Period instruments still use cat-gut (not really cat) to be more authentic sounding. Todays violins are tuned to A= 440 while Baroque instruments are tuned much lower (even as low as A=416).

Baroque violins will not have "chin rests". That is a modern invention. However, some, musicians will remove their "chin rests" from a "modern" violin due to personal preference.

Though most current "period instruments" are 20th and 21st Century remakes (most originals were "modernized" over time), some originally Baroque made have been transformed BACK (VERY EXPENSIVE TO DO), and some still retain their original Baroque set ups.

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Harlock999

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 12:22 pm

flylot wrote:
MisterE,

Actually the Baroque violin is quite different than the modern violin though from a casual observer, it can easily be overlooked. The neck of the violin is attached to the body at much less of an angle, straight in fact, and the fingerboard is somewhat shorter. Inside, the bass bar is smaller.

All Strads were "Baroque period instruments" originally and were over the years transformed into the modern style by other luthiers. An easy way to detect a replacement neck to transition an originally Baroque period instrument to a modern day style is to look for the graft joint at the scroll. My German made violin has such a graft.

Also, most modern violins strings today have a synthetic (Perlon, kind of a nylon) core and are wrapped in metal (silver, aluminum, and most recently titanium) except for the E string which is steel (sometimes Gold plated). This makes the string more stable and less likely to go out of tune. Period instruments still use cat-gut (not really cat) to be more authentic sounding. Todays violins are tuned to A= 440 while Baroque instruments are tuned much lower (even as low as A=416).

Baroque violins will not have "chin rests". That is a modern invention. However, some, musicians will remove their "chin rests" from a "modern" violin due to personal preference.

Though most current "period instruments" are 20th and 21st Century remakes (most originals were "modernized" over time), some originally Baroque made have been transformed BACK (VERY EXPENSIVE TO DO), and some still retain their original Baroque set ups.


Good stuff! Thanks for the info. I love musical instruments of all types and eras.
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Hermit

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 12:27 pm

Well, if it ain't Baroque, don't fix it. Wink
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MisterE
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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 12:56 pm

flylot wrote:
MisterE,

Actually the Baroque violin is quite different than the modern violin though from a casual observer, it can easily be overlooked. The neck of the violin is attached to the body at much less of an angle, straight in fact, and the fingerboard is somewhat shorter. Inside, the bass bar is smaller.

All Strads were "Baroque period instruments" originally and were over the years transformed into the modern style by other luthiers. An easy way to detect a replacement neck to transition an originally Baroque period instrument to a modern day style is to look for the graft joint at the scroll. My German made violin has such a graft.

Also, most modern violins strings today have a synthetic (Perlon, kind of a nylon) core and are wrapped in metal (silver, aluminum, and most recently titanium) except for the E string which is steel (sometimes Gold plated). This makes the string more stable and less likely to go out of tune. Period instruments still use cat-gut (not really cat) to be more authentic sounding. Todays violins are tuned to A= 440 while Baroque instruments are tuned much lower (even as low as A=416).

Baroque violins will not have "chin rests". That is a modern invention. However, some, musicians will remove their "chin rests" from a "modern" violin due to personal preference.

Though most current "period instruments" are 20th and 21st Century remakes (most originals were "modernized" over time), some originally Baroque made have been transformed BACK (VERY EXPENSIVE TO DO), and some still retain their original Baroque set ups.


Awesome! Thanks! I knew about the gut strings but had no idea about the fingerboard angle. I would imagine that the period tuning might ultimately make the violin sound different (perhaps not as bright) from less tension on the strings. I´ll look for a recording of Bach done on a period instrument at Baroque pitch.

I remember hearing that Nadia Salerno-Sonneberg deliberately tunes her instrument significantly higher than A=440 so it would be brighter. I guess the old saying applies- "Better sharp than out of tune", hahaha.



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MisterE
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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 1:41 pm

Ok, I checked it out.... very nice!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6QB6fIoNFc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZ9qWpa2rIg
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flylot

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sun Jan 02, 2011 2:29 pm

Very nice indeed!

Notice that even the bow hold is quite different. The modern day bow is held over the frog (that's the little ebony block underneath the heel end of the bow that the horsehair is attached to) where as the Baroque period bow, which has no camber and is shorter is held farther up on the bow somewhat away from the frog.

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beetlejazz

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:22 pm

Bumping this!

I'm glad I searched for a topic in this vein because I will totally check out Eric Whitacre, as I'm a fan of Arvo Pärt. Smile

I do listen to some classical. Among my favourites right now are Ligeti, Scriabin and I'm getting more and more interested in "Scriabinists" who ventured to the microtonal side - Wyschnegradsky's preludes in quarter-tones I go back to again and again.

Generally I'm really interested in microtonal and experimental stuff (like, say, Enno Poppe) - good painting music!

All-time favourites: Khachaturian, Rachmaninoff, Dvorak...

Nothing against some Baroque music either.

Stuff I never managed to get into: Beethoven, Beethoven, Beethoven. Sad No matter how I've tried, I just can't get anything out of it.


For those interested: Whyschnegradsky's prelude in quarter tones, no. 5
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tgwilt



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Location : Kissimmee, Florida
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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:54 pm

I listen almost exclusively to 'classical' music, without much regard to era. Right now I am loving the Bach Magnificat and B minor mass under the direction of John Eliot Gardiner and the English Baroque Soloists along with the Montiverdi Choir. The works are performed on period instruments.

Beethoven's 9 symphonies (yes, all of them) under the direction of John Eliot Gardiner are also on my current listening list.

Also like Mahler and Vaughn-Williams, Tallis, Dowland, Purcell, Britten, and on and on and on....

As a classical guitarist also, I find the works of Domeniconi, Albeniz, Granados, Britten, Martin, and too many others to mention, to be ethereal and able to induce meditation almost as well as a good smoke Smile .

Can't say I have a favorite, but am pretty partial to Bach. Never really cared for Brahms, but maybe it's time to listen again.

Tom
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Anasazi6

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PostSubject: Palladio   Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:41 am

One of my favorites is a modern classic called Palladio by Karl Jenkins. You've probably heard it. Check it out on YouTube.

Karl Jenkins- Palladio
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WarlockBob

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:10 pm

I'm glad someone else likes Mahler!

I have an extensive background(been playing multiple instruments since the age of Cool in all types of music, but orchestral and symphonic works more exclusively.

I find I thoroughly enjoy Baroque composers and works (Vivaldi, Bach, etc.) due to the form. Counterpoint and musical form in the Baroque Era was so pristine and exact that it makes my OCD brain very happy. tongue

After that, I enjoy the actual Classical Era more for the operas and full symphonies (Beethoven's repertoire, Don Giovanni, Rigoletto, etc.).

My favorite though would be Late Romantic to early Modern. You can't beat Dvorak and Shostakovich! Very Happy
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MisterE
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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:51 pm

^Bruckner is good for the ol' OCD. Same theme modulated upwards over and over. Glorified minimalism, haha.

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:51 pm

Mahler = bleech ! tongue

Mahler wrote what German musicians dismissed as "conductor's music" -- the kind of stuff conductors wrote that featured the endless instrumental voicing detail that ran through their heads as possibilities while they were working, but amounted to not so much unless length and volume counted. Unremitting depression & self-pity. Bummer every time.

The damn stuff takes endless rehearsal time, too -- it's so full of individual voice dynamics there's no getting out of slogging through the whole nine yards of it any time it's programmed.

Bruchner's a lot more pleasent unless you're a violin player. At least he's got a good heart. But your bow arm is going to be hanging by a thread from all the tremolandi. It's reduced me (and others) to resting my wrist on my knee & jiggling my hand after ten minutes of it.

There are places in Mitteleuropa where both are considered great, favorite masters -- in a class with Brahms and Beethoven. (!)

Kurt Masur said a really interesting thing re. concert programming for different countries : Italians find Bruchner boring, but respond positively to Mahler because he's full of shifting colors & sonorities.

Bruchner, I think, is a lot like Elgar in that he's appreciated much more on his native soil than he is abroad. Maybe unfairly.

What a Face
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Northern Neil

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Thu Jan 31, 2013 3:23 pm

Personally, I love composed music. But I cannot say I have urge to throw on a Motzart or any other "classical music" really ever. That being said, I love what Sufjan Stevens is doing with music composition today. Unlike the classical composers of the past who wrote the scores out in sheet music. Musical composers of today are able to put all the music together on a computer.

What Sufjan is doing is writing all the musical parts for the instruments on the computer and actually creating the sounds and music right there. Once the album writting is complete, he then transcribes everything onto sheet music so it can be performed by an orchestra. It is quite impressive actually.
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WarlockBob

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Thu Jan 31, 2013 3:28 pm

Sufjan Stevens is quite impressive, I do agree. I also have a very high opinion of the talent of Jason Mraz. He's definitely more jazzy or poppy, but his albums are all done extremely well and his live performances are 5X as good as his albums.
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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sat Feb 02, 2013 2:41 pm

Unfortunately, only the last 2:45 of this is available -- the conclusion of the 1st movement of Brahms' Fourth Symphony played by the Leipzig Gewandaus with Kurt Mazur directing them.

It's an excerpt from a DVD of them performing all four in Glascow in 1991 that's commercially available and -- if you ever want to hear Brahms performed the right way (their unbroken and fiercely preserved musical tradition goes back to Brahms himself) (actually, back to Mendelssohn, who was their Kappelmeister, as Mazur was later) and you can live with 1991 sonics/video and the winds drifting sharp, the set you want.

Don't miss the last ten seconds -- the tympanist blunders into the concluding ritardando with his head up his ass. The look Mazur impales him with is priceless.



What a Face
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Crookshanks

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Tue Sep 10, 2013 10:03 am

I don't really have an ear for Classical music but I like Bryn Terfel, does he count? scratch[/quote]
Bryn Terfel is brilliant, his "Songs of Travel" are worth hiking a long distance to hear - and the Finzi and Butterworth collections are spectacular.  While I would consider him an opera singer, his classical renditions of oratorio and art songs are special indeed.

I had an old recording of Leonard Warren on last night, another opera legend, probably one of the greatest bass baritones in the last century - died on stage at the Met from a massive coronary while performing the opera, La Forza Del Destino - the Force of Destiny.   He was a lion.

Those of you who like to try new things, you should look up a modern contemporary choral composer named Eric Whitacre - he writes for choir, and if you have a system that can keep up - it is some of the most haunting and beautiful music I have ever heard (very much like a secular Arvo Part).  There is a recording out by the Brigham Young University choir singing a compilation of his acapella works, that I highly recommend - look him on Pandora or your favorite music sharing site.  one of my favorite songs is "Sleep" originally written as "Stopping by Woods on a Snowy Evening" but the estate of Frost refused to let Whitacre use the poem for the lyrics of the song, so a friend of his wrote replacement lyrics about his toddler son sleeping - and it is magic.

Sorry so long - this is one of my things...Let me know what you think if you check them out.

B[/quote]
Awesome to see another opera fan around!!
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deathmetal

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PostSubject: Re: Classical   Sat Sep 05, 2015 1:06 pm

Quote :

curmudgeon

Life is best experienced with a curmudgeonly outlook. It prevents many deceptions.

As for classical, I'll endorse the aforementioned Mozart, add in Carl Nielsen and Ludwig van Beethoven, J.S. Bach, Franz Berwald, Jean Sibelius and Anton Bruckner, for starters. Great stuff. After a few months of listening to it, the ordinary background noise of mass culture just sounds like television commercial jingles.
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