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 Parker pipes?

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monbla256

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Age : 71
Location : DFW Metroplex, Texas
Registration date : 2012-01-15

PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:22 pm

Pm me your address and I'll get some off to ya Razz I think you will like it, especially if your a Royal Blend fan !
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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:25 am

Despite the efforts of pipe sharks on flea bay to hype them as hemi-semi-demi-Dunhills (which they never were), until fairly recently, older Parkers were good pipes for not a lot of money because they were blue-collar pipes in a market where everybody wanted the upper crust stuff (Sasienis, Barlings, Comoys, &c.)

There's a kind of rough justice in this in that, after 30 or so years of use, if you're looking for a great smoker, a good, old English pipe is a good, old English pipe, irrespective of the name on it. I.e., with proper care (and maybe an airway tweak to taste), a nicer old Parker or Bewlay is just as likely to become a favorite as a YOW TVF XXL or a Blue Ribband.

Two of them here (both straightgrain billiards) are A-Team members.

FWIW

What a Face
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Rusty

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Registration date : 2010-06-04

PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Sat Mar 24, 2012 1:46 pm

scottbtdmb wrote:
monbla256 wrote:
I never stated that Parkers made in the '50s or earlier were better. I only have some Hardcastles bought new around 1973/74 and they are GREAT pipes, no fills, well cut ebonite bits and nice qtr grain on 'em. I knew as many of us were told at that time that Parker and Hardcastle were merged and we began seeing Parker-Hardcastle pipes for sale. I guess since they were made in the same factory as Dunhills,( I don't know the EXACT address but I'm sure you do ) most folks presumed and it was stated that they were Dunhill seconds by some, and others said that Dunhill did not make or sell seconds. Since I was not privy to all the inside info ( as you obviously are) about the pipe buidness i just took it all with a grain of salt and bought my 'bac and put it in my pipes and smoked 'em. Please enlighten us as to THE truth about all this Dunhill/Parker/Hardcastle inticacies Razz

Moonbla, you are such a trouble maker, lol. I think the real question at hand is, if we stuck you, Rusty, and Kyle in a room and locked the door, what would we find the next morning when we unlocked and opened the door. affraid

-Scott

You'd likely discover three pipe smokers tellin' tall tales, enjoying a smoke, and maybe a bit of booze.
Pipe smoking chat is full of 'do this' and 'don't do that' and the actual reasons are often obscure even to the pipe lover repeating the 'wisdom'. We should endeavor to use our combined brains to find the reasons behind some of the terse wisdom.

We know Parker pipes are made in Chatham, Kent, England today. We know because the GM of the Dunhill pipe making division said so in a comparatively recent P&T magazine article. And some of us know that Colin Fromm and shop is in Chatham and that he is making Charatan pipes and possibly some Dunhill Collectors too. I doubt there are two pipe shops so it's clear that he is making Parkers. Colin Fromm, like Bill Ashton-Taylor, Barry Jones, Les Wood, the Marshall's etc is one of the older master pipe makers trained under the apprentice system of Dunhill and Charatan. He was from Charatan but was also associated (later) with Invicta and Castleford pipes.

Dunhill specifically said that Parker's are not Dunhill seconds. He also said that Parker pipes are made from a different grade of briar block than Dunhills. Parker's may have fills, whereas Dunhill's will not. We also know that the stems are made from precast vulcanite and not hand cut from rod. They are made in Chatham but stamped and graded at the Dunhill factory (Walthamstow).

Good smokers (good tasters) can pretty much occur under any brand (though they seem to be particularly partial to Italians) and reasonably well made pipes can also occur under just about any brand too. The interesting question is to what extent is there continuity in the brand and lines within the brand, esp old brands. When we look at some Parkers, eg the following URL, we see some particularly well cut classic shapes.
http://www.pipephil.eu/logos/en/logo-parker.html
Are the Parker pipes today a continuation of their old lines and the shapes as elegant and nicely cut or are they nice shapes but without any real relation to the Parker of the past? Which eras of the past too? Some insight into this question is the reason I was asking. I don't own any Parkers so I was hoping that some of you may have some insight esp if you're making recs about what to buy. Again though reasoning behind the wisdom is desired.
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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Sat Mar 24, 2012 3:46 pm

Seems odd they don't picture (or mention) their straightgrain stampings.

What a Face
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Rusty

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Registration date : 2010-06-04

PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Sat Mar 24, 2012 5:09 pm

Yak wrote:
Seems odd they don't picture (or mention) their straightgrain stampings.

What a Face

Seems odd to me too. Doesn't Phil have fans the world over that send him either their pipes or pics of their pipes with details so that he can expand the documented set?

So why would Yak hold back and deny Phil pics of his Parker straight grains?
Is he malicious? Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Sat Mar 24, 2012 5:26 pm

He's "photographically challenged." Meaning that, if there's no direct sunlight to photograph stuff like that in, his pictures come out lousy. Stamping :

PARKER
STRAIGHT GRAIN

Serif capital letters, 2.5 mm high

What a Face
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sisyphus

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Registration date : 2012-06-11

PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 8:54 am

there are Parkers and there are Parkers. If you find any, and they're still being made, Super Bruyere, Super Russet or Super Briar Bark, these are good, London made pipes. Not Dunhill quality but nicer than a modern Hardcastle or Ben Wade and a nice pipe for the money. If you find one that is stamped Parker of London, keep moving, nothing to see here.
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Ocelot55

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Location : Columbus, OH
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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:03 am

I've got 6 Parkers from many periods of production. By far the best I have seen and smoked are the Patent Parkers. If these aren't Dunhill seconds I don't know what they are. Nomenclature is similar, date stamped in a similar fashion to Dunhills, and occasionally you can find one with the same shape code. I'd stay away from the modern production. They have a heavy lacquered finish and a metal stinger.
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sisyphus

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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:13 am

Ocelot55 wrote:
They have a heavy lacquered finish and a metal stinger.

Those are the Parker of London pipes. I think they're made in France and they're not good.

The ones I mentioned, while you'll find fills, are much like the Parkers they were making in the 50s 60s and 70s. They don't use a stinger, but do have an aluminum inner tube, just like Dunhills.
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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:06 am

Somewhere in here, buried in all the posts, is a riff that George Dibos did on Dunhill design specs. When he posted it, the first thing I did was check my favorite old Parker billiard (1950s ?) against them. Nowhere even close.

One reason why the old Dunhills "look like Dunhills" is their High Standard of Standardness in proportions within any given shape. E.g., the bowl height to the shank length ratio will fall into the range A:B to A:C OR it won't be a Dunhill at all. Shank length to shank thickness &c. and right on down the line. Very tight set of parameters.

Yeah, there was a set of Parker stampings @ Dunhill. But considering that during their hay day they were buying more stummels from BBB (and others) than they were making themselves, and that Parker-Dunhill co-operation seems to have been minimal, the Dunhill-Parker Hybrid idea seems, statistically, pretty shaky most of the time.

What a Face
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Briar Spirit

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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 11:58 am

If you're strapped for cash then snap up a modern Parker pipe, I have a Dunhill pipe and I own 4 'new era' Parker pipes, all 4 Parker's are far superior to the Dunhill, they are fantastic pipes for their money, leaps and bounds above pipes in the same price range and many others substantially more expensive.

Of course you could listen to hearsay and spend more money than you need or buy someone else's 'old used pipe' if you like, your choice Buddy.
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KevinM



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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:25 pm

FWIW -- Last debate I heard on Parker vs. Dunhill went like 'dis here:

POV one -- Since they're made under the same roof, Parker's start out as Dunhills, but somewhere along the quality control line, if some teeny imperfection is found, maybe right at the very, very end, the pipe becomes a Dunhill reject and becomes a Parker, not a DH "second" because there is no such thing. In a moment it goes from an $800 briar to a $60 briar.

POV two cried "balderdash!" and held that beginning under the same roof is irrelevant, and a Parker doesn't even share the same briar block ancestry with the White Dot gene pool, let alone the same carvers, quality inspectors a/o standards.

I can't claim any insider knowledge to confirm or deny. Both are plausible, I guess.

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Ocelot55

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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:38 pm

Yeah, somewhere down the line the Parker/Dunhill relationship became murky (to say the least).

Still Parkers deserve to be recognized as Parkers, not just potential Dunhill seconds. I love my Parkers, and in my observation, the older ones smoke sublimey, regardless of whether or not they are a Dunhill second.

So if your looking for an old traditional English briar with a long interesting pedigree you might want to look into them instead of focusing solely on Dunhill, Comoy, Charatan, or GBD.
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monbla256

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Age : 71
Location : DFW Metroplex, Texas
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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:42 pm

Ocelot55 wrote:
Yeah, somewhere down the line the Parker/Dunhill relationship became murky (to say the least).

Still Parkers deserve to be recognized as Parkers, not just potential Dunhill seconds. I love my Parkers, and in my observation, the older ones smoke sublimey, regardless of whether or not they are a Dunhill second.

So if your looking for an old traditional English briar with a long interesting pedigree you might want to look into them instead of focusing solely on Dunhill, Comoy, Charatan, or GBD.

The most logical and sane response to this whole thing. Thanks for once again inserting some common sense and logic !Twisted Evil 
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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:41 pm

Decidedly so. The workmanship on old English blue collar pipes likely won't match the standards of the old big names but, after years of seasoning and use, they'll give nothing away in taste.

What a Face
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SpeedyPete



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PostSubject: Re: Parker pipes?   Sat Jul 06, 2013 9:40 am

Ocelot55 wrote:
I've got 6 Parkers from many periods of production. By far the best I have seen and smoked are the Patent Parkers. If these aren't Dunhill seconds I don't know what they are. Nomenclature is similar, date stamped in a similar fashion to Dunhills, and occasionally you can find one with the same shape code. I'd stay away from the modern production. They have a heavy lacquered finish and a metal stinger.

I have two of the old Parkers. Both are stamped Parker Super Bruyere.

The bulldog is stamped 73 Parker Super Bruyere on the left and Made in London England and a 4 in a circle on the right of the shank.

The billiard, with a forward leaning bowl, is stamped on the bottom of the shank with    24/F Parker Super Bruyere and Made in London England 4.

Both of these pipes are super, extremely good, smokers. They are my two top favourites.

I also have two of the "new generation" Parkers of which one is an extremely good smoker and the other is OK.
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