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 July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!

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MisterE
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Location : Mexico City
Registration date : 2009-08-24

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sat Jun 30, 2012 7:54 pm

Yo GK-

Curtiss-Wright XP-55. Cool

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Rob_In_MO

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Age : 44
Location : Park Hills, MO
Registration date : 2011-01-19

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sat Jun 30, 2012 8:06 pm

Darn you, Mister E - I just logged on and saw this....


Crap, you beat me to it...
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MisterE
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Location : Mexico City
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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sat Jun 30, 2012 8:14 pm

I'd never even heard of it until now. I know WW2-Korean War aircraft pretty well, but this one is rare. Shocked
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Rob_In_MO

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Location : Park Hills, MO
Registration date : 2011-01-19

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sat Jun 30, 2012 8:16 pm

EC - the only early-on problem with the P-38 that hasn't been mentioned yet was with aerodynamics related to the tail.

This was remedied in later versions, but early on it was a concern. At first ( I believe by the P-38D version) they added fillets to compensate for buffeting and tail flutter - which together could cause serious problems in a dive. Compression was still a problem however. Later versions were modified so as to nearly eliminate this problem.

Here's a little more info on this topic:

Quote :
The P-38J finally resolved the compressibility problems encountered in high-speed dives, when a shock wave forming over the wings made it impossible for a pilot to operate the elevators. Once this was understood to be the problem, Lockheed engineers designed small dive flaps, electrically-powered, that broke up the shock wave. These corrective dive flaps were installed on all P-38's, starting with late-block -J versions.
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George Kaplan

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Age : 47
Location : Kalamazoo, MI
Registration date : 2012-01-07

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sat Jun 30, 2012 8:53 pm

Good eye, Mr. E! I don't know how many were built, but that one was in pieces when they brought it in.They spent a couple of years restoring it.
Oh, and Rob,
Rob_In_MO wrote:
EC - the only early-on problem with the P-38 that hasn't been mentioned yet was with aerodynamics related to the tail.
I did mention the tail. Ironically, it was the sentence right after the one you quoted from my post! (Man! Talk about people not wanting to read!) Razz Razz
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DrT999

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Age : 59
Location : Piedmont of North Carolina
Registration date : 2011-08-31

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sat Jun 30, 2012 9:00 pm

George Kaplan wrote:
(Man! Talk about people not wanting to read!) Razz Razz

Teach at any level and you either get used to it (while trying to hold the line anyway) or go crazy affraid
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Rob_In_MO

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Age : 44
Location : Park Hills, MO
Registration date : 2011-01-19

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:37 am

George Kaplan wrote:

Oh, and Rob,
Rob_In_MO wrote:
EC - the only early-on problem with the P-38 that hasn't been mentioned yet was with aerodynamics related to the tail.
I did mention the tail. Ironically, it was the sentence right after the one you quoted from my post! (Man! Talk about people not wanting to read!) Razz Razz

Yup - sure did, George. Oh well, things happen. We've all done that on here a time or two...

It's all good, Sir.

Cool
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Blackhorse

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Age : 69
Location : Oregon City
Registration date : 2010-10-23

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:42 am

Remember guys, I'm not saying any one of these was the 'best' of its time...though the V-12 Rolls Mustang really stood out. In its non- bubble top iteration it was arguably the hottest looking rod around and I sure wouldn't want one of those bad boys commin' in on me! I just said they were the most recognizable.

I will say one thing though...remember its mission. I know we all have our favs, but if I was up in a B-17 with Messerschmidts all around, the Mustang is the baby I'd want coverin' my sorry ass.

If I were to pick something better, though not as well known by the general public it might be the Hellcat. It really had the 3 P's...Power, Protection and Pop! And I guess it flew pretty well too. Mostly in the Pacific I guess, but I'm no expert.

Rob...any data on the Hellcat over there? Or am I thinkin' of the Thunderbolt? No, I think the Hellcat was the one that replaced the TBolt.

BTW: Rob...do you want to give me a hand with the vote tally? We'll go ahead and count kaiser's...anyone voting from a hot zone is allowed to ask questions.

Also...I get to vote too...and it's cast for the Mustang. I won't choose myself for the prize though. That would be cheating you guys. Not a good example.
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Fishfuzz

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Age : 42
Location : Oregon
Registration date : 2012-05-24

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:46 am

Mustang fan since I was a youngster, and like my Cubs, I can't be switching sides now. Hope that's a good enough reason for the win. Wink
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George Kaplan

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Age : 47
Location : Kalamazoo, MI
Registration date : 2012-01-07

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:52 am

Rob_In_MO wrote:
It's all good, Sir.

Cool

Yeah, I remembered the smileys this time. Razz Razz
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huffelpuff

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Age : 47
Location : Laramie, WY
Registration date : 2011-12-10

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 2:00 am

Commander BH. No disrespect sir but many hundreds of missions were flown by the USMC in land based Coursairs. From places like Torokina airstrip on Bougainville, Munda New Georgia, or Vella Lavella.

Jim
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Rob_In_MO

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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 10:13 am

Blackhorse wrote:
BTW: Rob...do you want to give me a hand with the vote tally? We'll go ahead and count kaiser's...anyone voting from a hot zone is allowed to ask questions.

I'm on it, Commander Blackhorse. Cool
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Theophilus

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Age : 28
Location : Dallas, TX, USA
Registration date : 2012-06-08

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 10:23 am

Whoever thinks they'll be lucky enough to only be hit by a couple of inaccurate WWII era dumb bombs is in for a surprise...

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Rob_In_MO

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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 10:59 am

Blackhorse wrote:
If I were to pick something better, though not as well known by the general public it might be the Hellcat. It really had the 3 P's...Power, Protection and Pop! And I guess it flew pretty well too. Mostly in the Pacific I guess, but I'm no expert.

Rob...any data on the Hellcat over there? Or am I thinkin' of the Thunderbolt? No, I think the Hellcat was the one that replaced the TBolt.

In the European skies, the P-47 was predominant early on. It was later replaced by the P-51 for long-range escort missions, but several squadrons still preferred (and kept) the P-47 over the Mustang. While the Mustang was most often used as a fighter and escort, the Thunderbolt became a dual-purpose fighter-bomber, especially later in the war. One advantage the P-47 Thunderbolt had was how tough it was. It's sturdy airframe and tough radial engine could absorb a lot of damage and still return home. Some pilots readily chose to belly-land their burning Thunderbolts rather than risk bailing out. There are records of P-47s crash-landing after being shot down, hitting trees and absorbing impacts severe enough to snap off wings, tail, and even the engine, while the pilot escaped with few or no injuries. That's cool!

In the Pacific, the F6F Hellcat replaced the F4F Wildcat - though the F4F Wildcat continued in service by the US & RAF on the European front as a carrier-based aircraft, as well as in the Pacific. It didn't just disappear by any means.

While the Wildcat was a very functional carrier-based aircraft, it was no match for the A6M Zero. This, of course, let to the final development and production of the F6F Hellcat.

Quote :
Especially with the delays in the F4U program, the US Navy needed a superior carrier-based fighter in 1942-43. The Hellcat filled the bill. On average, it flew 55 MPH faster than the Zero; at about 20,000 feet it was 70 MPH faster. At altitudes in excess of 10,000 feet, it had a comparable rate of climb. At all altitudes, due to its heavier weight and greater power, it could out-dive the A6M. (This was generally true of American fighters; in a tough spot, the pilots could nose over, firewall the throttle, and zoom down.)


Last edited by Rob_In_MO on Sun Jul 01, 2012 11:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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Rob_In_MO

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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 11:01 am

Theophilus wrote:
Whoever thinks they'll be lucky enough to only be hit by a couple of inaccurate WWII era dumb bombs is in for a surprise...




You Rebel Scum!
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Kyle Weiss

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Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:37 pm

Rob_In_MO wrote:


You Rebel Scum!

Yeah! cheers
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Blackhorse

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Location : Oregon City
Registration date : 2010-10-23

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:40 pm

Two things. Yes I know the Marines flew the Corsair off islands and I think I said they were "primarily" a carrier based plane...common...with those flip up wings? And I also said I was no expert at specs and history and was just giving my 'sense' of what had happened. So let's not get into playing the finger pointing games wherein you discover some arcane factoid and prove you're better because of some point or other. I won't have it! I'M the COMMANDER and you'll be peeling taters for the duration bucko!!! Whew!

If I was flying in the Pacific, I'd want to be in a Hellcat. If in Europe, it'd be a Mustang. That's the "feel" if not what was really happening. And if I were to choose ONE plane out of the group of fighters in the WWII era it would be the Hellcat...but the Mustang was prettier...far more rakish. In any case, the specs on the Hellcat were stellar for it's time...and below it's pictured with it's nemesis, the Zero...which was always lighter and could outfly the US planes, but had no armor. So tactics played the major roll. The Zero could fire away at the Hellcat and it would absorb a LOT of rounds...but a couple of slugs into the Zero and that was pretty much it. Kinda like a Mazda Miata against a Ford Explorer (lol).


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kaiser83

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Registration date : 2012-02-22

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 1:05 pm

Blackhorse wrote:
BTW: Rob...do you want to give me a hand with the vote tally? We'll go ahead and count kaiser's...anyone voting from a hot zone is allowed to ask questions.

cheers cheers Shark Mouth!!! cheers
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George Kaplan

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Location : Kalamazoo, MI
Registration date : 2012-01-07

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 1:43 pm

Anyone else having problem rearranging their calendar to fit the chief's reality?
Blackhorse wrote:
Orders will be sent out no later than this Monday, July 1st.
Today being Monday, I went to work this morning, but it's been really hard doing everything by myself. Seems everyone else is still convinced it's Sunday.
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Rob_In_MO

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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 1:54 pm

Hey!

Hey Now!

The Commander has been under quite a strain lately, so let's lighten up. Ok?

Do you realize the efforts Commander BH puts into this every month?
Do you realize what a workload this is for him?



Keep it up, GK, and he'll have you 'peeling taters' for the duration as well. Cool


lol!
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kaiser83

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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 1:55 pm

"Sounds like someone has a case of the Mondays"
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George Kaplan

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Registration date : 2012-01-07

PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 2:03 pm

Did I not just say I'm complying with the exact letter of the commander's instructions, Rob? Just wondering how the rest of the squadron's doing on this fine Monday, that's all.
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huffelpuff

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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 3:25 pm

Commander 1500 lbs of spuds coming up. Thank you sir.

Jim affraid
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Rob_In_MO

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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 3:53 pm

George Kaplan wrote:
Did I not just say I'm complying with the exact letter of the commander's instructions, Rob?

Oh I know. I just had to say that, it was too good to pass up. Twisted Evil

I actually wondered about that myself, just didn't want to say anything. I'm pretty sure that he meant Monday the 2nd. Either way - Inbox is awaiting target identity & bombing coordinates.

The one thing we haven't seen this month so far is the Roster. If the Commander needs assistance with any of this, all he has to do is ask...
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tech2576

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PostSubject: Re: July Bombing...a Red, White and Blue Extravaganza!   Sun Jul 01, 2012 3:58 pm

I have to go with the p-38.
Only aircraft I saw as a kid that I could recognize no matter what angle or how high.

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